flybigjet : Do commercial pilots usually fly this low over a foggy ocean?

Was in Germany last week and toured the Sinsheim Auto and Technik Museum. Would highly recommend spending at least a half day here. https://sinsheim.technik-museum.de/en/

They have both the Concorde and Tupolev which you can access (along with others). Countless number of aircraft inside as well.

nunzo wrote

Was in Germany last week and toured the Sinsheim Auto and Technik Museum.

The helicopter is interesting: An Aeroflot Kamov Ka-26, NATO designation Hoodlum was in reality CCCP-24054 and it wore an Aeroflot scheme for the ferry flight to Germany in May 1973 where it was eventually to become D-HBAU with City Bau AG. It has been preserved at the Auto & Technik Museum Sinsheim in these fake colors since May 1987.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamov_Ka-26

Lady Jane wrote

flybigjet : Do commercial pilots usually fly this low over a foggy ocean?

I flew into LAX yesterday (very) early-- it looked *exactly* like that (minus the whale, though).

You get a pretty good speed check when you go from clear air to juuuuussssst skimming the tops of an overcast deck.

R.

flybigjet wrote

I flew into LAX yesterday (very) early-- it looked *exactly* like that (minus the whale, though).

You get a pretty good speed check when you go from clear air to juuuuussssst skimming the tops of an overcast deck.

R.

6R?

ezaircon4jc wrote

6R?

ANGLL4 RNAV off of HAKMN. CRCUS to 25L. 004SCT, 009OVC- Temp/DP were within a couple points of each other.

ATC (as usual) mucked with our speeds on the arrival, which is always fun.

We were slowed to 210 high and kept fast until almost on top of GIGI.

The "Michelin Speedbrakes" (i.e. the gear) are your friend in that situation. As is the phrase "gear down, flaps on schedule".

R.

Lady Jane wrote

flybigjet : Do commercial pilots usually fly this low over a foggy ocean?

I know this question was for flybigjet, but how could I resist helping out?

Only when flying their Breachcraft Model 18.

Llarry wrote

Amazingly, the pilot of this Marine FG-1D Corsair managed to successfully return after a late-WW2 combat mission over Japan in June of 1945. I'm guessing this Corsair never flew again.

Hey Llary,

This photo has been showing up on some of the F4U Facebook group pages. I follow them because my dad flew them. Anyway, the story that this plane's damage was caused in a combat mission appears to be incorrect. According to the information I learned on the F4U group page, here is the correct information. To be sure, I don't know if the info I am sharing here is correct either! It does seem more plausible given the damage to the aircraft.

Here is the information I found:

This Corsair FG-1D (88441) of VMF-113, piloted by 1st Lt. Russell Hunchar, was involved in a ground incident on 4 July 1945 with an FG-1D (88339) also of VMF-113, piloted by 2nd Lt. M.W. Harke.
The WO entry provides these details:
"On 4 July Hunchar in 88441 was rolling out after landing when he was hit from behind by 2Lt Harke in 88399 who had landed too fast and close. Both aircraft were damaged beyond repair."
Here's the official report:

Here is a photo of the original accident report.

Also, here is a link to the accident report from

https://asn.flightsafety.org/wikibase/252107

sygazelle wrote

Hey Llary,

This photo has been showing up on some of the F4U Facebook group pages. I follow them because my dad flew them. Anyway, the story that this plane's damage was caused in a combat mission appears to be incorrect. According to the information I learned on the F4U group page, here is the correct information. To be sure, I don't know if the info I am sharing here is correct either! It does seem more plausible given the damage to the aircraft.

Here is the information I found:

This Corsair FG-1D (88441) of VMF-113, piloted by 1st Lt. Russell Hunchar, was involved in a ground incident on 4 July 1945 with an FG-1D (88339) also of VMF-113, piloted by 2nd Lt. M.W. Harke.
The WO entry provides these details:
"On 4 July Hunchar in 88441 was rolling out after landing when he was hit from behind by 2Lt Harke in 88399 who had landed too fast and close. Both aircraft were damaged beyond repair."
Here's the official report:

Here is a photo of the original accident report.

Also, here is a link to the accident report from

https://asn.flightsafety.org/wikibase/252107

Your info makes sense -- that FG-1D would've had a tough time staying in the air given what we are seeing in the photo. So much for a good story, though...

Here is another unique modern Japanese military aircraft: The Kawasaki Aerospace C-2. The Japanese government has made a particular effort to develop national aerospace industries, and the C-2 is an excellent example. When looking for a military transport aircraft, there were a number of good choices available internationally, but Japan chose to develop a transport in-country.

The C-2 is considerably larger than a C-130J but smaller than a C-17. The max takeoff weight is about the same as the Airbus A400M. It shares some design features with the P-1 patrol plane that was developed about the same time.

The C-2 first flew in 2010 and entered service in 2016. Delivery of 22 aircraft is ongoing.

The second prototype C-2 was converted into an RC-2 SIGINT aircraft; I'm not sure if additional RC-2s will follow.

For Phantom Friday, let me cover the German use of the Phantom. Germany was the largest export customer for the Phantom.

The initial order was for 88 RF-4E recon Phantoms in 1971. Shortly thereafter, Germany ordered 175 "lightweight" Phantoms for the Luftwaffe. These unique aircraft omitted one fuel cell and the capability to fire the Sparrow missile, making them among the most agile F-4s; they got the unique designation of F-4F.

The Luftwaffe RF-4Es, initially unarmed, got some ground attack capability in the 1980s, but were retired by 1994. Some went to other NATO air forces.

110 F-4Fs were upgraded in the early 1990s, getting a new radar (borrowed from the F-18) and the capability to fire AMRAAM missile; the modifications were called the improved combat efficiency (ICE) program. The German F-4Fs were retired by 2013.

Lady Jane wrote

flybigjet : Do commercial pilots usually fly this low over a foggy ocean?

This is actually a concern for Navy helicopter pilots at low level just above a low fog layer. I recollect that there was a case in the late 1960s or early 1970s where a Navy SH-3A or D from an ASW carrier was hit by a broaching whale and lost. The helicopter and its three crewmen were lost.

EDIT: OK, so nobody bit on my bogus story... never mind.

.

flybigjet wrote

ANGLL4 RNAV off of HAKMN. CRCUS to 25L. 004SCT, 009OVC- Temp/DP were within a couple points of each other.

ATC (as usual) mucked with our speeds on the arrival, which is always fun.

We were slowed to 210 high and kept fast until almost on top of GIGI.

The "Michelin Speedbrakes" (i.e. the gear) are your friend in that situation. As is the phrase "gear down, flaps on schedule".

R.

So "very early" was after 0630? We're supposed to be "over-ocean" (land 6R & depart 25R) between midnight and 0630 for noise abatement, but that has been fudged a few times. The turn-around was aways fun!

One morning the tower sent a DC8 around off 6R because the previous arrival wouldn't have clear in time. The weather was good enough to have the DC8 switch to 6L (he was sent around on about a mile and a half final) so I asked the tower what makes more noise, a DC8 going around or a DC8 landing on 6L? I got no response.

ezaircon4jc wrote

So "very early" was after 0630? We're supposed to be "over-ocean" (land 6R & depart 25R) between midnight and 0630 for noise abatement, but that has been fudged a few times. The turn-around was aways fun!

One morning the tower sent a DC8 around off 6R because the previous arrival wouldn't have clear in time. The weather was good enough to have the DC8 switch to 6L (he was sent around on about a mile and a half final) so I asked the tower what makes more noise, a DC8 going around or a DC8 landing on 6L? I got no response.

We touched down just about 0700L.

R.

Llarry wrote

This is actually a concern for Navy helicopter pilots at low level just above a low fog layer. I recollect that there was a case in the late 1960s or early 1970s where a Navy SH-3A or D from an ASW carrier was hit by a broaching whale and lost. The helicopter and its three crewmen were lost.

EDIT: OK, so nobody bit on my bogus story... never mind.

I was about to bite, but then I realized it was just a tall tail.

sygazelle wrote

I was about to bite, but then I realized it was just a tall tail.

Guilty as charged, your honor.

Another DCA near mid air. https://www.yahoo.com/news/collision-warning-sounds-cockpit-delta-233009157.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall

Missing man formation for a funeral at Arlington National it appears.

Llarry wrote

Guilty as charged, your honor.

It was a breach on two counts: It was a tall tale and also a tall tail.

....I'll close the door on my way out.

M-technik-3 wrote

Another DCA near mid air. https://www.yahoo.com/news/collision-warning-sounds-cockpit-delta-233009157.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall

Missing man formation for a funeral at Arlington National it appears.

When I was working at SLC TRACON one day a flight of 4 F16's took off of Hill (HIF) Air Force Base heading west out to the range with a Skywest Metroliner (SW3) north of SLC entering the downwind leg. They were procedurally separated by1K' as two separate sectors would normally work the flights. Since we rarely split the sectors, I was working both. The fighters cancelled their instrument flight plan (which they usually did) and wanted to climb. I called traffic to Skywest and the fighters. The fighters called the SW3 in-sight and climbed almost right though the Merlin! Skywest let out a whoo-hoo and said 2 went above him and two below! That must have been a sight! He never complained, but I'm pretty sure most others would have.

flybigjet wrote

We touched down just about 0700L.

R.

That's definitely very early for we retired peep! Woke up at about a quarter past eight this morning!

The Lockheed F-104 Starfighter was a sensation when unveiled in the 1950s. It used the new General Electric J79 afterburning turbojet engine to achieve astonishing speeds and incredible climb rates -- the latter despite minimal wing area. It also saw widespread use around the world with U.S. allies and was license-produced in a number of countries. Designed as an interceptor, it morphed into a multirole fighter that was useful in air defense, strike and even nuclear bomb delivery missions.

Designed by Lockheed's C. L. Johnson of U-2 and A-12/SR-71 fame, the first F-104s were two XF-104s that first flew in the spring of 1954. The J79 engine was not quite ready, so the XF-104s were powered by a less powerful Wright J65 engine.

The YF-104A followed the XF and was fitted with the J79 engine; it first flew in early 1956. Given the revolutionary design, development was difficult and protracted. The production F-104A did not enter U.S. Air Force service until January 1958. While the initial design used the new M61 20mm rotating-barrel cannon as its primary weapon, the Sidewinder infrared-homing air-to-air missile was also available for the F-104A (and all subsequent models).

Given the limited fuel capacity of the F-104 and teething pains with a new Mach 2 fighter, USAF orders were limited; just 153 A models were built. To aid pilots in the challenging transition to the new fighter, 26 dual-control F-104Bs were also produced. The Bs had an enlarged fin and rudder for stability, reduced fuel capacity and omitted the cannon armament. The F-104A/B equipped three USAF fighter squadrons of the Air Defense Command for about a year, following which they were turned over to Air National Guard units. During their brief period of active duty, one squadron was deployed to Taiwan during the Taiwan Strait crisis of 1958; they served as a deterrent to Communist Chinese aircraft during this month-long deployment.

The 1950s were all about nuclear weapons capability and deterrence and so it is no surprise that the next Air Force model, the F-104C was repurposed as a Tactical Air Command fighter-bomber and given the capability to deliver a B28 or B43 nuclear bomb. The C also had improved avionics and was ultimately given a refueling probe for aerial refueling. Again, the limited range and endurance led to limited USAF orders: 77 F-104Cs and 21 F-104Ds were delivered.

The F-104 had not escaped the attention of a number of allied air forces. Lockheed pitched an improved version to Germany for use as an all-weather multirole fighter. Germany became a major customer and bought F-104G, RF-104G and TF-104G models that equipped both air force and Navy squadrons. Other NATO nations followed suit, and the F-104 was built in large numbers (about 1,500) in Europe. Canadian production of this model by Canadair totaled 200 CF-104s and the RCAF also bought 38 Lockheed-built CF-104D two-seaters. CF-104s comprised the backbone of Canadian air commitment to NATO for years and were optimized for nuclear strike and recon.

Japan also purchased F-104s: 210 F-104Js and 20 F-104DJ trainers. The majority were built by Mitsubishi. These were used as interceptors.

The combat history of the F-104 in American hands was limited. It was deployed to Taiwan as previously mentioned, and later to Europe during the 1961 Berlin crisis. The major deployment of U.S. F-104Cs was to Vietnam in 1965 and again in 1966-67 where they flew combat air patrols to deter North Vietnamese flights into South Vietnam and flew close air support missions. The USAF F-104s did not make any air-to-air kills during the Vietnam War, but a number were lost to Vietnamese air defenses and one strayed into Chinese air space and was shot down by a J-6 (MiG-19).

In 1967, the F-104C/Ds were transferred to the Air National Guard; by 1969 all active USAF F-104s were gone. The F-104Cs and Ds remained in service with the ANG in Puerto Rico until 1975, which marked the end of U.S. military service.

14 ex-USAF F-104As/Bs were transferred to U.S. ally Pakistan in 1961 and saw considerable use in combat with Indian fighters during the period 1965-71. In 1972 these aircraft were grounded due to lack of spare parts.

The Republic of China Air Force (ROCAF) was one of the longest users and operated quite an assortment of F-104s. They got 78 new F/RF/TF-104Gs built by Lockheed and Canadair and 201 used F-104A/B/D/G and TF-104Gs from Germany and Denmark.

The ultimate F-104 was the Italian F-104S; FIAT built 246 of this version, of which 40 went to Turkey and which could fire radar-guided missiles and had other improvements. F-104Ss got upgraded radars as F-104-ASAs and then further updates as F-104-ASA/Ms. The Italian
-104s were the last of any nation to be retired in 2004.

I've not addressed the use of F-104s by the American NASA, nor the continued use of F-104s for air shows by civil users. I've also not recounted the world speed and climb records established by the F-104 in the early days. Further details can be found in the Wikipedia entry.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_F-104_Starfighter